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Gemini front end 
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:18 am
Posts: 83
Car(s): LS1 Powered EJ Special
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Has anyone out there ever tried to fit a Gemini front end to a Bellett?

I ask this as there a multiple brake options for a Gemini. I am looking at modifying it to suit as to increase the room in the engine bay and remove the shocker towers. The Gemini has the same format but I have seen one done with shockers fitted conventionally between the A arms.

Let me know what you think.

Thanks


Tue May 05, 2015 2:36 am
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:18 am
Posts: 83
Car(s): LS1 Powered EJ Special
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No comments on the front end??

All comments welcome.

Thanks


Wed May 06, 2015 8:41 am
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Don't want to be a downer but nothing is interchangeable between gem and bell. :|


Wed May 06, 2015 8:50 am
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Joined: Fri Nov 07, 2008 9:05 am
Posts: 530
Location: Western Victoria
Car(s): Wasp, Bellett GT, Bellett Sedan, Prince Skyline GT, Porsche tractor,Toyota 700, 996 Carrera 4,Prince Clipper
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Maybe a Gemini front end could be adapted - same as the "hot rodders " do with Holden front ends etc. ....................?

KB

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Wed May 06, 2015 9:31 am
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Joined: Tue Oct 28, 2008 12:17 pm
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Location: Rye Park, N.S.W.
Car(s): Doris, Aunty Mary, Shrek, Jimmy; GT, Wasp, Florian & Sed unrestos; 65 Elf; worn 02 Forester; 07 Santa Fe CRD, Sigma.
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I dont know much about mods like this, but its not something I've heard of being done before. I suppose the Gemini has a lot of Opel in it, so its a totally different car. I reckon getting the whole steering geometry sorted would be a challenge.
I have however seen amazing Street Machines at the Summernats, so its evident that anything is possible, given time, money and dedication.
I know an xp Falcon build that incorporated sheetmetal replacements for all the upholstery, bar the fibreglass bucket seats. Amazing work, but it ran to 6 figures......

Cheers, Matt.

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Wed May 06, 2015 11:44 am
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Joined: Sun Dec 12, 2010 10:04 am
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Location: Gladstone Queenland
Car(s): '70 PR91,'69 PR20 x 2,'66 PR20,'65? KR20's x 2,'66 ? PR90,2012 d22 STR Navarra.
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I wrecked a TF Gemini just for the 5 speed gearbox. I kept the front end to see if it would fit.
Mount points are out and the geometry for the wheel alignment would be a nightmare.
Stud pattern different and if you did get the member to mount the procuring of a hub is limited.
You will have the same problem similar to the disc brake conversion.
I agree with Gunna. Nothing fits. :(

Dave.

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Wed May 06, 2015 12:24 pm
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Joined: Mon Jan 05, 2009 10:39 am
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Location: Adelaide Hills
Car(s): GQ Patrol, 1968 bellett ratter, 1969 florian deluxe & 1976 Luv
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I see where your going in the brake upgrades that are available for the Gemini.
Not sure if the Gemini front end would adapt readily to the bellett, but there are stranger combinations out there!
the other option may be to adpt a better brake set up to the bellett, a lot of slip on rotors out there now, and all it would take is machining up a hub to go on the spindle that the rotor would go on, and adapting the calliper with mounts to suit.
I am not saying it would be easy but just another idea.
I love the ideas you are putting out there!

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Wed May 06, 2015 9:55 pm
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Try front brakes off a 85-92 Magna.


Thu May 07, 2015 1:56 am

Joined: Sun Mar 07, 2010 8:06 am
Posts: 166
Car(s): PR90, PR91, Teardrop Bellett Sedan, Yamaha YB100
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Can check out my Magna conversion if you need. Have just finished it. Callipers are cheap as at UPullit but make sure the clips for brake pads are there, they are rare as. I am at Tea Tree Gully.


Thu May 07, 2015 2:08 am
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:18 am
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Car(s): LS1 Powered EJ Special
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Thanks for the comments.

I have just gone out last night and measured up a Gemini front end and there is only 10mm difference in track and the main crossmember will fit between the chassis rails of the Bellett there is obviously modifications to be done to mount it to the front of the Bellett but nothing I haven't done before.

The advanges is the brake options and also the engine mount to fit an SR20DET and the gemini front crossmember sits further back in the engine bay and gives me sufficent clearance as the SR has a front mounted sump and it is part of the structural intergrity of the block.

I have consulted the engineer about removing the high mount shockers on the gemini front end a reworking the lower control arms to fit coil over shocks so I can remove the shocker towers out of the engine bay of the Bellett to give me more room to fit the turbo and all the other gear as the SR is a big engine.

This is all theory at this stage and once I fit the front end and mock up the engine then we'll know if it all fits. I have a front end coming in a couple of weeks and it is low cost so if it doesn't work nothing lost.

Thanks
Jeff


Thu May 07, 2015 3:34 am
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Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:54 am
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Forget the Gemini stuff. Will be a nitemare and will never be rite. Fabricating one off pieces is far easier and works a lot better.
I've proven that.

Disc brakes for a Bellett is now easier than ever. A member of the BCCV sells an authorised engineered kit that uses common parts. Fits inside a standard 13" wheel too. Not using Magna stuff either as that's far from bolt on.... This is straight bolt on and done by anyone in an afternoon who knows which end of a spanner to hold.
Seriously.

A Bellett engine bay is far smaller than a Gemini, so grand plans of different engines that fit into Geminis is not a correct reference. Your best friend is a tape measure.... And fabricate everything.
Believe me.

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Fri May 08, 2015 1:11 am
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Joined: Sun Jul 08, 2012 12:52 am
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Car(s): John White DOHC Gemini Group A touring car
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Why SR20? Do you have one lying around? Not the best engine imho.


Fri May 08, 2015 3:06 am
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Joined: Tue May 10, 2011 2:23 am
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Location: Melb.
Car(s): '72 Sport Bellett (imported 180912), had Belletts in past, 2 sed, 3 GT's. M/B A250 Sport, i30
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PR91 wrote:
Forget the Gemini stuff. Will be a nitemare and will never be rite. Fabricating one off pieces is far easier and works a lot better.
I've proven that.

Disc brakes for a Bellett is now easier than ever. A member of the BCCV sells an authorised engineered kit that uses common parts. Fits inside a standard 13" wheel too. Not using Magna stuff either as that's far from bolt on.... This is straight bolt on and done by anyone in an afternoon who knows which end of a spanner to hold.
Seriously.

A Bellett engine bay is far smaller than a Gemini, so grand plans of different engines that fit into Geminis is not a correct reference. Your best friend is a tape measure.... And fabricate everything.
Believe me.

This is a very nice conversion as Brett says. Easy fit and engineered. Parts pretty to find in most wreckers. I bought some of the parts already. Wrecker had 4 - 5 cars in stock.

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Fri May 08, 2015 3:58 am
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Joined: Wed Oct 03, 2012 7:18 am
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Car(s): LS1 Powered EJ Special
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The main reason for trying this set up is clearance for the SR20det as it won't fit in the standard engine bay as obviously Matt's GT is going to be cut up so was going to try as a custom sump for an SR20 and its is nearly a grand to make and it is part of the integrity of the block.

The SR choice is due to availability of parts etc as the V8 is too big a lot cheaper but too big and the Bellett will be a dog to steer.

If someone can send through the details for the new disc brake kit for the standard front end I will have a look at that too and maybe look at another engine combo.

Thanks again guys I do appreciate all your comments it does help put some things into perspective.

Jeff


Fri May 08, 2015 11:11 am
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Joined: Tue Sep 16, 2008 11:54 am
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The disc kit is sold as a complete kit, not just a list of parts to get and what to do. This is one of the engineer report requirements.
That's why I haven't given any specific details publicly, and won't do.

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Fri May 08, 2015 1:52 pm
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Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2012 3:18 pm
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Location: Beaudesert
Car(s): 1970 opel gt, 1965 type 3 VW custom ute
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Hi
I have fitted a gemini front end in my opel gt
It was nothing like the original.
I removed the mounts from the gemini cross member and made new ones to suit so they sat over the x mem from front to back so it could sit together even without welding.
the hardest thing is the gemini lower arms (rear bush )normally mounts on a stud from the fire wall.
you will need do something similar.
I make everything about 2mm short so washers or shims are used to get thing just write.
The x mem slants back slightly and i made a rod with awasher each end that fitted across the firewall bolts and used it as a jig

all in all a good front end standard gemini geometry and pleasure to drive.


Fri Feb 26, 2016 8:51 am
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